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  1. Natural Finish Army

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    Quote Originally Posted by jbrandt
    Hi Gene,

    Could you comment a little further on this?

    By allowing the top bushings to contact the hoop, the drum is not floating, it is resting on the hoop. I would think that the two areas you don't want to apply mount forces to are the tension rods away from the strength of the lug and the hoop itself. These are the areas that can most easily affect tuning.

    I have always thought that the most intelligent way to adjust the Optimounts is to collapse the mount tightly up against the lugs. The weight of the drum then rests on the lower bushings through the lower lugs. The upper bushings are close to the lug where the strength of the lug is and where they can cause the least amount of deflection in the tension rods.

    Since the hoop floats on the head and the head floats on the shell, all the mount forces ultimately get transferred into the shell through the lug attachment screws anyway. Doesn't it make more sense to get the Optimount forces as close to the lug and as far from the hoops as possible?

    I appreciate your many valuable contributions to this forum. If you have any access to to Pearl engineers, I would be interested to hear their views on this subject.

    Thanks,
    Jeff Brandt

    Gene, I'd like to here your reply to this.

    Also, If you are relying on the hoop to hold up the drum. Why not just use the I.S.S. mounts.

  2. Drum addict

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    Why isn't this a sticky?

    I just got around to going with Gene's suggestions on the Optmounts and had to search around for this thread.
    2001 MRX Platinum Mist
    2002 BRX Wine Red
    2006 Ref Purple Craze

  3. Drum addict

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    Quote Originally Posted by jpcdrummer
    Why isn't this a sticky?

    I just got around to going with Gene's suggestions on the Optmounts and had to search around for this thread.
    Anybody, anybody, Bueller?
    2001 MRX Platinum Mist
    2002 BRX Wine Red
    2006 Ref Purple Craze

  4. Natural Finish Army

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    Quote Originally Posted by jpcdrummer
    Anybody, anybody, Bueller?
    So what is your conclusion ???

    I wish Gene would come back to this thread.

  5. Drum addict

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    Quote Originally Posted by phips
    So what is your conclusion ???

    I wish Gene would come back to this thread.
    I think there is a difference. I believe the hanging toms sound slightly more open and are a bit easier to tune, especially the t-rods that support the mounting.
    2001 MRX Platinum Mist
    2002 BRX Wine Red
    2006 Ref Purple Craze

  6. Bill Johnson

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    What does it take to make it a sticky? It sems to me that having this information in a more readily accessable location would make sense. Would it be more suited for the Pearl First Aid section?
    Bill Johnson

    Pearl Reference Series Granite Sparkle
    14x6.5, 10x8, 12x9, 14x14, 16x16, 22x18

    Zildjian Cymbals A Custom

  7. Registered User

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    Apr 2005
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    I tried the "float" method and every other possible Opti-Mount positioning I could think of without much success. The results were two degrees of "choking": Bad and worse. The only time the drums didn't choke terribly was when they were tuned within a very small tuning range. Once I strayed from that tuning range, even the slightest bit, the drums choked badly.
    Opti-Mounts aren't very effective because they break some basic "rules" of sound suspension. The basic rules, in a nut-shell, are:
    1) No direct contact with the shell. Not a problem with Optis.
    2) Lateral forces applied to the drum and to anything connected to the drum (lugs, T-rods, hoops, etc.) should be minimized. The drum should be equally balanced so that lateral forces are not applied to a small area of the drum. This is achieved by placing the mount's main attachment points at no less than 180* from each other. This allows the drum to "float". Anything less than 180* results in excess lateral force to the attachment points. This "torques" the T-rods, lugs, hoops, and shell and does not allow the drum to vibrate freely. Opti-Mounts torque the lugs, T-rods, and shell because the mounts pull out on the top two lugs and push in on the bottom two lugs. Equal balance is not achieved. I.S.S. Mounts and Star-Cast Mounts torque and pinch the hoops, YESS Mounts and Mapex I.T.S. Mounts torque the shell, and Sonor's mounts and old Premier Signia-style mounts torque the lugs. I'm not familiar with DW mounts.
    3) The mount should be constructed of a material that does not readily absorb sound waves. Aluminum is good. Steel is not so good. Optis are made of steel.
    The main goal of suspension mounts should be to keep the sound waves within the drum, with as few as possible being directed elsewhere (stands, tom arms, racks, etc.). If sound waves are detected anywhere else, the drum will likely "choke". It is comparable to an electrical short circuit.
    Follow the basic rules to minimize "choking". The more rules you break, the worse the choking.
    In my opinion, RIMS Alloy Mounts are the most effective suspension mounts available today. Until I got RIMS, every drum I've ever had "choked" (to varying degrees) when I mounted them. All of my toms now sing with RIMS.
    RIMS Mounts follow the basic rules of sound suspension. The weight of the drum is evenly distributed across the RIMS band so that it "floats". If mounted properly, zero to minimal lateral force is applied to the T-rods, lugs, and shell. They are constructed of an aluminum alloy.
    I'm not trying to "rip" on Opti-Mounts or any other suspension mount, but I've never been too pleased with the results. If they work for you, GREAT! If you think you may need something else, I strongly suggest giving RIMS a try. Learn about them at www.gaugerpercussion.com.

  8. I'm not Lebowski; I'm the dude

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    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    I've read that too (out of panic!) when I was still waiting for my Refs while Ref owners first started ripping on the new Optis.

    I have RIMS on my old Tama kit and still remember what a HUGE difference they made when I installed them (back in the day, drums didn't come with isolation mounts).

    My Refs sound great, but I'll be the first to admit that they don't resonate as much as my Tamas, but for some applications, you don't necessarily WANT toms to resonate for days.
    For sale!:
    13" Zildjian A Mastersound top/New Beat bot HH's
    12" Zildjian Z splash
    PM me for pricing!

    Pearl Ref (SF) 8x7 10x8 12x9 14x11 16x13 22x20

    Snares, Tama Artstar II Limited kit, Yamaha/Roland kit

  9. Drum addict

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    Quote Originally Posted by veggyboy
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    I've read that too (out of panic!) when I was still waiting for my Refs while Ref owners first started ripping on the new Optis.

    I have RIMS on my old Tama kit and still remember what a HUGE difference they made when I installed them (back in the day, drums didn't come with isolation mounts).

    My Refs sound great, but I'll be the first to admit that they don't resonate as much as my Tamas, but for some applications, you don't necessarily WANT toms to resonate for days.
    BINGO!

    That is why I use moongel. Listen good here: I DON'T WANT ALL THE TONES THAT ARE POSSIBLE. People bust on moongel and other forms of damping but sometimes the drums just RING too damn much.
    2001 MRX Platinum Mist
    2002 BRX Wine Red
    2006 Ref Purple Craze

  10. Drum addict

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    BTW, no offense to anybody but I think we have gotten a little out of hand on this choking thing. A few years ago there was an article in the Washington Post about people who spent literally fortunes on their stereos. They had these big isolation tables for their cd players and huge dollar amps and crap that cost tens of thousands of dollars and had virtually zero harmonic distortion. In the end, I think it was mostly nonsense. I feel the same about drum mounting. My MLX kit that had lugs the length of the drums and holes in the shells sounded amazing. How do people explain that????

    The difference between my old kit and what we have now should be night and day, but it's not. It is quite insignificant when you talk about sound pressures on stage at a live event. I've said before: When I was in high school, the Air Force band came and played at my school. Our school had a REALLY beat up set of Premier drums that had horrible heads on it. The drummer made them sound like they were the best damn drums on the planet. I realized then that "the drums don't make the man". We are talking about probably the last 1% of resonance here. Tuning is much more important. Listen to your favorite drummers, Katche, Hakim, Bruford, Gadd, Weckl, Smith (Steve that is), etc. Are any of them using RIMS? Do they sound fricken AWESOME?

    Just remember this when people are telling you you have to spend major $ on RIMS.
    2001 MRX Platinum Mist
    2002 BRX Wine Red
    2006 Ref Purple Craze

  11. Natural Finish Army

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    Great post jpc,I do think we tend to turn things into science projects at times. I believe you can take this a step further and apply it to drums. High end vs. Mid/Entry level. ? ? It has been discussed before.

  12. I'm not Lebowski; I'm the dude

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    Quote Originally Posted by jpcdrummer
    BINGO!

    That is why I use moongel. Listen good here: I DON'T WANT ALL THE TONES THAT ARE POSSIBLE. People bust on moongel and other forms of damping but sometimes the drums just RING too damn much.
    Damn JPC, calm down! I don't care if you use Moongel. It was that other PDF member that was ripping you!

    It doesn't bother me that you bastardize your new drums and G2s with dampers. Hell, put paper towels under the heads too! So what if you can't properly tune your drums. I say "use Deadringers" and no one will know the difference! It's not a big deal to me that you're not sophisticated enough to appreciate "singing" drums. Long live the cardboard box!
    For sale!:
    13" Zildjian A Mastersound top/New Beat bot HH's
    12" Zildjian Z splash
    PM me for pricing!

    Pearl Ref (SF) 8x7 10x8 12x9 14x11 16x13 22x20

    Snares, Tama Artstar II Limited kit, Yamaha/Roland kit

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