Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

DLX Head Choices

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • DLX Head Choices

    Okay so I have a large 80's vintage DLX kit and I am looking again at replacing the heads. I want something that will bring out the deep tones in the DLX shells with some resonance and some overtone control. I could use some sort of dampener if need be but prefer not to. I am somewhat meticulous with tuning as I like my kit to sound great both live and recorded. I used a Drum Dial for tuning and spend a lot of time on each drum to get each lug pretty much exactly the same.

    So...all you DLX owners out there, fire away...what heads are you using and what would you recommend based on my wants and desires.

    I have the following tom sizes
    8 X 8 rack
    10 X 8 rack
    12 X 10 rack
    13 X 11 rack
    14 X 12 rack
    14 X 14 floor tom
    16 X 16 floor toms
    14 X 8 Maple Snare
    2- 22 X 16 Bass drums but I have already found the heads I like there!
    My wife says I am no longer permitted to buy any more drums...I said okay you cant buy any more shoes...we are presently at an impasse! I see drums...she sees shoes!

  • #2
    Hey OBH.
    I was always happy with pinstripes on top, ambassadors on the bottom. That is perfectly in tune (no pun intended) with focussed tunings.
    Then I added opti's. and stayed with that head choice.
    I have added the air suspension feet to my FT legs though..
    With opti's, and even with pinnies, the toms have opened up quite a bit.

    Some say emperors over ambassadors. I feel that's less focussed than pinnies, but more open.
    The most open sound you will get is ambassadors over ambassadors.

    Evans users will prolly tell you EC2's over, whatever. I'm not an evans fan at all.

    The easiest way to tell is buy a bunch of different batter heads for one tom, over a "constant" reso.
    This cuts down experiment costs.
    Whatever you like will more than likely will carry itself across the rest of your toms.

    The same drum dial setting on a single ply head is going to give you different tunings on a dual ply head.
    IMO, the settings from lug to lug as a dial setting are much less important than the two heads having the same overall pitch.
    A guitar tuner can tell you this. Mask the opposite head by having it lay on a piece of carpet.
    For my 8,10,12,13,14,16 DX kit, 4th's work nicely...
    My revamped Pearl DX kit (now with 8" tom)
    My refurbished 72 NC Deluxe Pearl Kit
    My early 80's G314LXDC Pearl Snare
    Catalogue Corner Thread
    Restoring and refinishing (vintage) drums
    My Snare build

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by oldbatterhead View Post
      Okay so I have a large 80's vintage DLX kit and I am looking again at replacing the heads. I want something that will bring out the deep tones in the DLX shells with some resonance and some overtone control.

      So...all you DLX owners out there, fire away...what heads are you using and what would you recommend based on my wants and desires.
      When I owned a DLX I used Smooth White Emps over clear Ambs .. they have a more darker focused sound than their clear counterpart .. mids and lows are brought out

      But like 3pk said .. "The easiest way to tell is buy a bunch of different batter heads for one tom, over a "constant" reso.
      This cuts down experiment costs.
      Whatever you like will more than likely will carry itself across the rest of your toms."

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by 3pearlkits View Post
        Hey OBH. I was always happy with pinstripes on top, ambassadors on the bottom. That is perfectly in tune (no pun intended) with focussed tunings. Then I added opti's. and stayed with that head choice. I have added the air suspension feet to my FT legs though.. With opti's, and even with pinnies, the toms have opened up quite a bit. Some say emperors over ambassadors. I feel that's less focussed than pinnies, but more open. The most open sound you will get is ambassadors over ambassadors. Evans users will prolly tell you EC2's over, whatever. I'm not an evans fan at all. The easiest way to tell is buy a bunch of different batter heads for one tom, over a "constant" reso. This cuts down experiment costs. Whatever you like will more than likely will carry itself across the rest of your toms. The same drum dial setting on a single ply head is going to give you different tunings on a dual ply head. IMO, the settings from lug to lug as a dial setting are much less important than the two heads having the same overall pitch. A guitar tuner can tell you this. Mask the opposite head by having it lay on a piece of carpet. For my 8,10,12,13,14,16 DX kit, 4th's work nicely...
        I've jumped around between heads on mine from Remo pinstripes, ambassador, emperor to Evans EC2s, G2s and about every other possibility from the two companies and I always came back to pinstripes over ambassadors personally! I loved the attack that they had but just enough resonance for me. My other kit, 4 ply Maple Masters (MMX) I do vintage emperors over ambassadors and love it. On my DLX though I've always preferred clear heads, and pinstripes have just been "it" for me on that kit.

        Good luck in your search!
        Pearl MMX - 10, 12, 13, 14, 16, 22 Diamond Burst
        Tama Starclassic B/B - 12, 14, 16, 20 Shattered Turquoise
        Pearl Wood Fiberglass - 10, 13, 14, 16, 24 Satin Cocoa Burst
        sigpic

        Comment


        • #5
          Okay...so I have decided I am going to go with pinstripes on batter side and ambassadors on resonant side...now the questions comes up...where does everyone in North America buy their drum heads? I can go to my local music store but they want an arm and a leg for heads for my whole kit...anyone find good pricing out there that will ship in the US or Canada?
          My wife says I am no longer permitted to buy any more drums...I said okay you cant buy any more shoes...we are presently at an impasse! I see drums...she sees shoes!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by oldbatterhead View Post
            Okay...so I have decided I am going to go with pinstripes on batter side and ambassadors on resonant side...now the questions comes up...where does everyone in North America buy their drum heads? I can go to my local music store but they want an arm and a leg for heads for my whole kit...anyone find good pricing out there that will ship in the US or Canada?
            Check out guitar center and musicians friend to see if they have any combo packs to save some money. I usually just go to my local drum shop, but I live near Dale's drum shop which is one of the best on the east coast, so I'm spoiled.
            Pearl MMX - 10, 12, 13, 14, 16, 22 Diamond Burst
            Tama Starclassic B/B - 12, 14, 16, 20 Shattered Turquoise
            Pearl Wood Fiberglass - 10, 13, 14, 16, 24 Satin Cocoa Burst
            sigpic

            Comment


            • #7
              Drumfactorydirect.com has some nice pricing on heads. I really like Remo Ebony Emperors on my DLX toms.
              -Tama Granstar (12, 16, 22)
              -Yamaha 7000 Series (12, 13, 16, 22)
              -Crush Sublime E3 (10, 12, 14, 14sn, 16, 22)
              -An array of snares
              -An array of cymbals

              Comment


              • #8
                Sam ash. I got a 10", 12", 14"x2 and a 16" vintage emp coated for $77. Free shipping. Can't beat that with a stick!
                Mapex Saturn V in deep water ash burl: https://www.pearldrummersforum.com/a...p?albumid=1218

                Comment


                • #9
                  Just went put a coated Emp on my DX 10" tom... Amazing! Deep rich and lush tone with great warm sustain.
                  -Tama Granstar (12, 16, 22)
                  -Yamaha 7000 Series (12, 13, 16, 22)
                  -Crush Sublime E3 (10, 12, 14, 14sn, 16, 22)
                  -An array of snares
                  -An array of cymbals

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    OK, I know this is an older thread and OP has bought new heads already, but for future reference:

                    On a kit this size, I would seriously consider using different, graduated heads as the diameter increases (all over amb/G1 resos):
                    8 and 10" toms: G1
                    12 and 13 toms: G12
                    14 rack tom: G14
                    Floor toms: something double ply (emp, G2, vintage amb, pinstripe, EC2, etc.)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Why?
                      My wife says I am no longer permitted to buy any more drums...I said okay you cant buy any more shoes...we are presently at an impasse! I see drums...she sees shoes!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I am trying out something close to what FreDrummer says , on my wood/fiberglass kit. I am really happy with Evans G2's ( clear ) on my floortoms but i am now going to try G1's ( clear) on the smaller toms (13,14) to see if i get more tone and a "open" drum. On all toms/floortoms i have Remo Diplomat coated reso side.
                        Reason i am trying this is because G2 is 2 ply and G1 is 1 ply.
                        Last edited by DLX100#; 09-21-2016, 06:54 AM.
                        http://www.pearldrummersforum.com/sh...id-80-s-DX-kit

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by FreDrummer View Post
                          OK, I know this is an older thread and OP has bought new heads already, but for future reference:

                          On a kit this size, I would seriously consider using different, graduated heads as the diameter increases (all over amb/G1 resos):
                          8 and 10" toms: G1
                          12 and 13 toms: G12
                          14 rack tom: G14
                          Floor toms: something double ply (emp, G2, vintage amb, pinstripe, EC2, etc.)
                          Okay I am trying to understand your reasoning for the variety of different drums heads. The way I see it...and this is my opinion only whether it be correct or not is irrelevant. If you have a drum set, a specific series, whether it be MLX, DLX, DX, MX, or Masters series, the drums shells themselves are made of the same materials. Given that they are the same materials, the tones of the drums should technically be similar, the resonance of the drums should be similar, the only variances would be the pitches of the drums based on there diameter and depth. Drum heads are built in series as well. Diplomats, Ambassadors, Emperors, Pinstripes and of course the various Evans and other brands out there. The idea behind using the same drum heads on each drum is to produce similar tones across the drums. In my opinion, if you use different heads across the same series of drums, you would be creating a wide variety of tones out of the same series of shells which could affect the overall sound of the kit. I am no sound or acoustical engineer but I can identify the variances in the tones of my kit based on the drum heads I use. 2 ply heads give me deeper tones with far less resonance and ring, whereas single ply heads give my drums a much more open, less muffled, sharper tones with more resonance and ring, (great for playing outdoors by the way) but hell in the recording studio, at least with the sound engineers I have worked with in the past. if I was to mix and match the heads in my kit, I would get a variety of different sound characteristics from each drum and likely drive myself nuts...once again in my opinion. I am sure there are other far more experiences professionals out there that could speak to this and I would love to hear their opinions and or expertise!
                          My wife says I am no longer permitted to buy any more drums...I said okay you cant buy any more shoes...we are presently at an impasse! I see drums...she sees shoes!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hmmm

                            OBH sure the shells are all the same with a given series (Reference being one exception).

                            Sure, different shell materials are picked because of the properties/characteristics those materials "display" in regard to tone. Think of the maple vs birch argument as an example of this.

                            When it comes to heads though, as you've rightly pointed out, single or double ply heads make the drums respond differently.

                            As a live drummer for example, one can use the same heads across the toms in your kit, because that's what you like. They will sound similar and respond in similar fashion. Add durability for double plies as a +, they're a minus due to increased purchased costs.

                            That's not enough for some. They want every tom to sound as "best it can". And will try every possible combination of heads for that one tom. Once they find the right combination in their mind, they will move on to the next tom.
                            Please notice I said, "in their mind",
                            It is totally subjective. What works for one person doesn't mean it will for another.

                            In the bad old days SE's wanted you to gaffa the heck out of all your drums so they were dull, almost lifeless (substitute in moongel for gaffa lol). That way they kinda controlled the recorded sound.
                            Over the years, driven by drummers, more open resonant sounds have become more acceptable to a lot of engineers.
                            So, heads on a drum to drum basis can change that.

                            And, TBH, I kinda understand. A pinny on my 8" doesn't seem to get the same response/resonance/tone as a pinny does on the 10", or 12" etc etc etc.
                            If I was really worried about it, I'd change it to something else on the 8".

                            I happen to really like pinny's over ambassadors on my DX.
                            I've tried other heads and combinations over time.
                            But I always go back to what I know works best, for me.

                            And, when it comes to heads, all anyone can offer you is advice...
                            My revamped Pearl DX kit (now with 8" tom)
                            My refurbished 72 NC Deluxe Pearl Kit
                            My early 80's G314LXDC Pearl Snare
                            Catalogue Corner Thread
                            Restoring and refinishing (vintage) drums
                            My Snare build

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by oldbatterhead View Post
                              1. the drums shells themselves are made of the same materials. Given that they are the same materials, the tones of the drums should technically be similar, the resonance of the drums should be similar, the only variances would be the pitches of the drums based on there diameter and depth.

                              2. Drum heads are built in series as well. Diplomats, Ambassadors, Emperors, Pinstripes and of course the various Evans and other brands out there. The idea behind using the same drum heads on each drum is to produce similar tones across the drums. In my opinion, if you use different heads across the same series of drums, you would be creating a wide variety of tones out of the same series of shells which could affect the overall sound of the kit. I am no sound or acoustical engineer but I can identify the variances in the tones of my kit based on the drum heads I use.

                              3. 2 ply heads give me deeper tones with far less resonance and ring, whereas single ply heads give my drums a much more open, less muffled, sharper tones with more resonance and ring,
                              A few others began to explain it, but I'll add my part. I couldn't figure out how to multi-quote your post, so I assigned it some numbers above. I try to think of it from the physics angle...a drum head is a film that has a certain thickness and area. Impact waves -- from a drumstick strike, or, in the case of a reso head, from the sound waves traveling down through the drum to it -- will have different characteristics depending on the thickness and area of the head. The thickness part of the equation will have to do with the overall elasticity of the head -- a 7 mil Diplomat will be more elastic than a 12 mil Ambassador X, even if they are made of the same mylar. The area of the head will influence how far the head can deflect when struck...surely a 18" tom head will deflect more than a 8" tom head (this will also impact the wavelengths of the waves from the original strike). I realize your set only goes up to 16" tom, but if we imagine the radical differences between an 8" tom and an 18" tom, it might help illuminate the points. Also, as others have said, yes, this is all subjective, so we can do whatever we want with our drums. There is no right or wrong here. So, this brings me to:.

                              Point 1. This is the only point I am inclined to actually disagree on. Surely you don't believe the only difference between an 8" tom and an 18" tom is pitch, do you? That 18" tom is working with longer wavelengths and is moving a lot more air! I think of an 8" tom sounding like "Bing, bing bing," while an 18" is going to be "Boommm, boommm, boommm!" Surely there are differences of resonance and sustain! Using your logic, one should also used the same head on their bass drum, too, because the shells are the same materials and construction as the other drums, no? Put another way, how many times have you seen a thread on a forum started by someone who just cannot control the sustain on their floor tom? The standard advice is, besides tuning tricks, to use thicker heads or 2- ply heads or some sort of dampening device (whether a part of the head design or external). How many times has someone needed to seek advice on reducing sustain on an 8" tom? Never.

                              Point 2. Yes, but no one ever said they have to be used in series. I believe the tompacks can be useful when there is not too much separation between sizes. But on a kit that goes from 8" to 16?" I simply believe one can get a better overall result with graduated heads.

                              Point 3. Yes. I absolutely agree. Even the manufacturer's websites confirm this. Here has been my experience with my 12, 13, 16 MLX...The G12 works REALLY well on the 12 and 13 toms, but on the 16" FT just sounded thin without enough "Oomph." I use G14 or some double ply heads on that floor tom to make it a cannon. But, again, let's look at some extremes. Say you put Diplomats all the way around from 8" to 18." I'm sure they'd be OK on the 8 and 10, but on the 16 and 18? Sure it depends on genre -- if playing lighter styles with higher tunings it might work, but probably not tuned low and hit hard for rock. Now take it to the other extreme: the extremely thick 2-ply heads, the ones with two 10 mil plies PLUS a reinforcing dot. I would think it would be hard to even attain a useable tone out of an 8" drum with those heads. On the 18, it would sound huge (but I'm not sure I would ever be a fan of those heads in general). So, the idea is to use lighter heads on smaller toms for that "more open, less muffled, sharper tones with more resonance and ring." As one moves down to the larger drums, one can use 2-play heads to get " deeper tones with far less resonance and ring."

                              The whole point is to achieve a rough balance of resonance, ring, and sustain across the kit so your high toms sing and your low toms growl (OK. I stole that line from the Evan's website )

                              I hope this helps!
                              Last edited by FreDrummer; 09-23-2016, 02:13 PM. Reason: spelling

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X