4 ply vs. 6 ply help!

[RYAN LOWE]

Okay, tried the search function, nothing... It may just be me, but it's hard to search for "4 ply vs. 6 ply" as I did; I got nothing. So, sorry to re post, because I do remember seeing this question before.

Anyway, over the past few months I have had many great offers to buy smoking hot masters kits, in 4 ply MMX. I have only ever owned/played the 6 ply maple, and 6 ply birch. I do know that my last kit was reference specs and in the end did NOT offer me the volume/attack I was after (I assumed mainly due to the edges). Knowing more plys = more volume, I started to think the 4 ply may not work for me. I have now missed out on owning a few very nice MMX kits because I am so worried the 4 ply with rings wont be loud enough, or offer me the attack I enjoy with the 6 ply. Can anyone shine some light on this? Anyone compared them? Volme? Attack? Anyone play metal or loud rock with a 4 ply masters?

Thanks in advance. Should this get "cleared up" on my end (i.e., I find the 4 ply will still rock just as hard and loud) I have a nice used kit to put together (still plan on a new MRP or MW order though, very, very soon!).

[SLIPKNOT1]

Keep in mind, while an MMX has 4 ply shells, it does have reinforcement rings as well. And also try to not to forget that their is no such thing as a "Ply Standard".

A Pearl 6 ply shell in the Masters line is 7.5mm thick while a Keller or DW 6 ply shell for example is 4.2mm thick. Describing a drum shell by plys means nothing if your talking about multiple brands.

The thinner the shell, the more it will vibrate. But the volume will be less
The thicker the shell, the less it will vibrate, but the louder the drum will be. You will hear more attack from the head rather than the tone from the shell. This is why thicker shells are used with most snares and bass drums.

The MMX is an amazing drum line because it combines the best of both worlds. The thin shells have great tone that is bright but the rings focus the attack much more. So you get a great sound from the drum head as well.

[nathanieljobe]

There's more to consider than just number of plies. Too many folks get caught up in that without considering the thickness of the plies and the kinds of woods as well.

What's better: 6 thinner plies or 4 thicker ones? Mahagony or birch? Maple? hybrid? And nothing says that a thicker 4-ply and thinner 6-ply are going to come out to the same overall thickness either.

Thinner plies and less mass actually resonates more freely because its lighter and it takes less energy to get it moving. Heavier drums with more mass move more air and are louder but generally resonate less because it takes more energy to keep them moving.

Consider your playing style--do you hit hard and like a drum to scream out with a solid fundamental that decays more quickly or are you a lighter hitter who likes to draw out more sublte breaths from the instrument, letting it ring?

In addition to plies and thickness, think about the various qualities of the woods as well. Some woods are just heavier than others, so you can get away with fewer plies and achieve the same mass as you would with more plies of a lighter wood, if you are willing to accept the musical qualities of the wood itself.

Personally, I prefer mahagony with thinner shells and fewer plies, but that's just me. Keep on researching to find that right combination, but remember--it is a combination of factors that will give you the sound you want!

[RYAN LOWE]

just to clear things up, if this was mistaken, I am only talking pearl masters shells, 4 ply vs. 6 ply, no other brands.

I have not seen if the 4 ply is the same thickness as the 6 ply, is it? I do know playing a 6 ply with light wood (poplar export) had very loud volume, that I so enjoyed. It was not as warm as maple, but just as loud. It got me thinking that perhaps a thinner shell may be just as loud, but not as warm, or something similar.

I guess the bottom line is, I need to try them myself to be 100% sure.

[quicksticks]

The 6 ply is 7.5 mm and the 4 ply is 5 mm with 5 mm reinforcement rings. I own a 6 ply mcx kit as well as a 4 ply gmtx 4 ply snare (3plies maple and an outer ply of tamo, with maple reinforcement rings). I have played the two snares side by side. They have the same heads. The difference is subtle. You can definitely rock with the 4 ply. The rings will add strength to the shell and focus to the sound.

[steel5blue]

The 6 ply is 7.5 mm and the 4 ply is 5 mm with 5 mm reinforcement rings. I own a 6 ply mcx kit as well as a 4 ply gmtx 4 ply snare (3plies maple and an outer ply of tamo, with maple reinforcement rings). I have played the two snares side by side. They have the same heads. The difference is subtle. You can definitely rock with the 4 ply. The rings will add strength to the shell and focus to the sound.

+1.
I have owned, and played un-miked rock shows w/ both MMX and MRX (6ply) kits. The loudness factor was never an issue. The MMXs are plenty loud, maybe slightly more difficult to tune, because of the increased resonance, and -as somebody has pointed out- require less force to sing.
Just think of all the rockers who play thin-shelled DW kits these days.

[Rullrich 5150]

ian paice plays 4-ply birch masters , <correct me if i am wrong> and it's far from low-volume sounding kit. surely 6-ply has better projection

I love how my mmp kit gives that sensitivity and natural sound to my ear. I also have the same situation when thinking that 4-ply might give me not enough volume when playing unmic'ed, I just test it with comparing both MMP vs MRP , I simply like MMP for it's natural , full and fat tone , still it gives me good projection and attack

[czx]

Can anyone shine some light on this? Anyone compared them? Volme? Attack? Anyone play metal or loud rock with a 4 ply masters?

I]

Roman, I have owned them both and played extensively solo/practicing and with my medium-duty rock band. If you are playing alone most of the time, the MMX is satisfying as you can hear all of the tone and buttery low end. Once you are in a band situation, for the most part (of course there will be rare occasions where you have a killer sound system/mic's and everything is perfect), almost ALL the buttery low end just blends straight in with the bassist if he/she is at all remotely heavy. I could not hear most of my kits sound, the majority of the time, in the band situation.

The MRX/MLX/MRP shell while you play solo, is more mid-range and attack oriented and still very satisfying. They are more "powerful" IMO. More "Sonor-like" I guess. (I am Sonor guy...hehe)
IN A BAND SITUATION, these sound much better, IMO, than the 4 ply with average sound system and/or mic's. You can hear the drum SOOOO much better which is how it should be in the first place.

With my band and either dry or with an average system, my 6 ply was SUPERIOR to the 4 ply. I COULD DEFINITELY hear most of my kits sound. While I was practicing alone, it was a toss really.

[Harleydan]

I've owned both series Ryan. The sound/attack you are looking for is the MRX shell. I don't think the MMX shell will give you what you want. The 7.5mm 6 ply has more projection and attack. I personally think the MMX series shells are the finest shells Pearl has ever made and I love them. But, for what you want, the 6 ply is the ticket.

[Jutt8]

I've owned both series Ryan. The sound/attack you are looking for is the MRX shell. I don't think the MMX shell will give you what you want. The 7.5mm 6 ply has more projection and attack. I personally think the MMX series shells are the finest shells Pearl has ever made and I love them. But, for what you want, the 6 ply is the ticket.

I agree with Dan based on what you are looking for Ryan. You should without question get the MRP's--6 ply.

here is my experience and take on what I have. These general rules should apply to the maple version as well. I have played both MMX and MRP and the general idea is the same in my comparison below. I love the warmth, punch, and volume of the 6 ply maple actually better than the mmx if you can believe that. Everyone has their own opinions.

6 ply --bright and punchy initial attack but with good low end finish--you know you had them. They project wonderfully live unmic'd which is one reason I got them. The sustain is fantastic. The 6 ply kit is very clean when playing around the kit or doing a sextuplet type fills. THis is especially apparrent on the bigger toms. Everything is distinctively heard and clear. this is especially true of birch vs maple. I'm currently enjoying this kit a bit more at the moment. It's just so great live mic'd or unmic'd. I reallly loved the MCX's tone the last time I played one. It just sounded so warth and punchy going down the kit. The toms blended wonderfully together.



4 ply with re/rings ---it has a warm vintage sound and resonates wonderfully. I also have triple flanged hoops on them. These drums record wonderfully as well. They are not as in your face as the 6 ply kit live. They just aren't, but they are warm and have a lovely tone. These drums and the MMX kits have been labeled as one of Pearls finest kits by many members on the forum who have owned many different kits from many different companies so I am trying not to be biased here because I own them. They do have a sound that I think appeals to most listeners as being pleasing to the ear on all levels. I'll leave my biased comment to that.

I do believe unmic'd that the 6 ply shells are more present in my experience.

[RYAN LOWE]

Hum... this sucks, because I love emerald fade and would really love a huge double bass! I just dont want to spend thousands on a kit that wont cut "my" mustard. Hum... Wish I could play one. You just cant walk into a music store anymore (like you could 2005) and play different masters kits. You may get lucky and find MCX or reference, but no more different masters kits in stock. ARGH!!!

[czx]

Hum... this sucks, because I love emerald fade and would really love a huge double bass! I just dont want to spend thousands on a kit that wont cut "my" mustard. Hum... Wish I could play one. You just cant walk into a music store anymore (like you could 2005) and play different masters kits. You may get lucky and find MCX or reference, but no more different masters kits in stock. ARGH!!!

You are set on trying which shell ?? ... and which colors will you settle for ?? I am pretty good about locating kits.

[RYAN LOWE]

If I could find a 6ply maple masters, I would die for anything that could be found in double bass, 10, 12, floor toms, in sparkle finishes, greens, and blacks.

[Jutt8]

If I could find a 6ply maple masters, I would die for anything that could be found in double bass, 10, 12, floor toms, in sparkle finishes, greens, and blacks.

Why don't you just stick with the SMX that you have? That's 7.5 mm maple isn't it?

[RYAN LOWE]

Why don't you just stick with the SMX that you have? That's 7.5 mm maple isn't it?

Oh yes, this is ideal and perfect, dont get me wrong, I am not looking to replace the SMX at all, just want a nice "home" kit is all. The SMX I just need another kick, maybe the floor and it's finished! Love that kit! It is hard to near impossable to find a add on kick though. I should just shut up and order the MW or MRP and get the wait going. Faster the better.