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Reference Pure with Die Cast Hoops and Volume Question

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  • Reference Pure with Die Cast Hoops and Volume Question

    When I was making a decision between the original Reference and the Pure, I liked the idea of both but preferred the lugs on the Pure and wanted more resonance. Is it true that the original is much louder or is it quite close in volume and the die cast hoops are the main thing causing the difference in sound? Drums being loud is very appealing to me.

    That leads me to ask if it would be worth buying some Mastercast diecast hoops for the batter heads or both and I would be able to get the best of both worlds?

    Thanks
    Chris

  • #2
    I would just stick with your stock hoops.
    Those are great drums. What heads are
    you running on your kit ?
    Eric G : Pearl,pAiSTe,Remo,Vic Firth,SKB,Roc n Soc,Roland V-Drums. Masters MCX Chestnut fade.
    22"x18",10"x8",12"x9",16"x16". Ian Paice Snare.sigpic Why not ...

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    • #3
      I believe the volume difference has more to do with the shell thickness than hoops.
      My previous Ludwig kit; Pearl Sensitone Aluminum , Pork Pie, Black Panther and Crush snares.
      DW 5000, Pearl modded P-102, P-120P & P-2002B. IC Powerglide. Many cymbals from the big 3.
      Tiny pic of my old cymbal setup.
      sigpic

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      • #4
        Originally posted by perduramo View Post
        When I was making a decision between the original Reference and the Pure, I liked the idea of both but preferred the lugs on the Pure and wanted more resonance. Is it true that the original is much louder or is it quite close in volume and the die cast hoops are the main thing causing the difference in sound? Drums being loud is very appealing to me.

        That leads me to ask if it would be worth buying some Mastercast diecast hoops for the batter heads or both and I would be able to get the best of both worlds?

        Thanks
        Chris
        I agree with the others. If you like the RFP hardware, you're not going to find a noticeable difference in volume. There are too many other factors.

        Upgrading with Mastercast hoops is going to cost a significant amount. Part of the concept of the RFP was to use lighter weight components throughout.

        MM
        2021 Masterworks / Matte Black Mist

        18x20 KD, 14x16 FT, 12x14 FT, 8x10 TT, 6.5x13 SD, 10x12 FSD

        2022 Masterworks Cocktail Kit / Bright Champagne Halo

        16x16 KD (verticle), 5x10 SD, 5x8 TT, 5x12 TT

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        • #5
          I'm going to go on the record and say, no drum is louder or quieter than the other. The volume is determined by the player. Both a thin shell kit and a thick shell kit can blow out your ear drums.

          That said, the shell difference between the RFP and standard RF series lends itself to playing a certain way. The drums react differently to the playing style. The RFP will be able to open up and sound fuller than the RF drum at lower volumes because the shell, hoops and lugs have less mass to 'excite' and help it contribute to the sound of the drum. The thicker RF shell with the diecast hoops and heavier lugs will require more energy to be driven into the head to get that shell to contribute to the sound and get the most out of it. The RFP kit may be better suited for the player who prefers to play with something like a 5A stick, doesn't typically play music that requires you to smash the hell out of the drums and likely plays smaller venues that don't need a ton of volume. The RF series is likely for the heavier hitter who thinks anything thinner than a 5B is a toothpick, typically likes to use 2B sticks, hits their drums as hard as possible and has dreams of playing Madison Square Garden. There is nothing wrong with either player or either kit, but you have to choose the right kit for your playing style. Throwing die cast hoops on an RFP kit will only shorten their sustain and focus their sound to limit the overtones. As a former RFP owner, that removes the beauty of the RFP's sound.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Tommy_D View Post
            I'm going to go on the record and say, no drum is louder or quieter than the other. The volume is determined by the player. Both a thin shell kit and a thick shell kit can blow out your ear drums.

            The RF series is likely for the heavier hitter who thinks anything thinner than a 5B is a toothpick, typically likes to use 2B sticks, hits their drums as hard as possible and has dreams of playing Madison Square Garden.
            I like to bring the 2B sticks to church gigs whenever they make me play in a drum shield.
            2021 Masterworks / Matte Black Mist

            18x20 KD, 14x16 FT, 12x14 FT, 8x10 TT, 6.5x13 SD, 10x12 FSD

            2022 Masterworks Cocktail Kit / Bright Champagne Halo

            16x16 KD (verticle), 5x10 SD, 5x8 TT, 5x12 TT

            Comment


            • #7
              These kits, Reference on the left and Reference Pure on the right, were set up at one of the drummer's lunches Pearl hosted. Pearl's Raymond Massey did a drum off with Ray Luzier. First, Raymond is a beast behind the kit and as good as he made the Reference kit sound the Pure that Luzier played was like the epitome of how drums should sound. They blew me away!
              When I got a new kit a couple of years ago I couldn't justify the cost of me playing a Pure kit in bars so I opted for a Session Studio Select. It kills but I still wonder how a Pure kit might sound and feel like.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Tommy_D View Post
                I'm going to go on the record and say, no drum is louder or quieter than the other. The volume is determined by the player. Both a thin shell kit and a thick shell kit can blow out your ear drums.

                That said, the shell difference between the RFP and standard RF series lends itself to playing a certain way. The drums react differently to the playing style. The RFP will be able to open up and sound fuller than the RF drum at lower volumes because the shell, hoops and lugs have less mass to 'excite' and help it contribute to the sound of the drum. The thicker RF shell with the diecast hoops and heavier lugs will require more energy to be driven into the head to get that shell to contribute to the sound and get the most out of it. The RFP kit may be better suited for the player who prefers to play with something like a 5A stick, doesn't typically play music that requires you to smash the hell out of the drums and likely plays smaller venues that don't need a ton of volume. The RF series is likely for the heavier hitter who thinks anything thinner than a 5B is a toothpick, typically likes to use 2B sticks, hits their drums as hard as possible and has dreams of playing Madison Square Garden. There is nothing wrong with either player or either kit, but you have to choose the right kit for your playing style. Throwing die cast hoops on an RFP kit will only shorten their sustain and focus their sound to limit the overtones. As a former RFP owner, that removes the beauty of the RFP's sound.
                I disagree. Play a poplar export then play a full maple kit and the maple kit will be much louder.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by keaton_86 View Post
                  I disagree. Play a poplar export then play a full maple kit and the maple kit will be much louder.
                  And both can still blow your ear drums out. There is maybe 1-2 decibel difference between the two. Maybe. We aren't talking about drastic volume changes. What you are likely hearing between the two is how maple and poplar can emphasize and dampen certain frequencies. How different bearing edge profiles can emphasize or dampen attack, etc. This will change which frequencies are more or less pronounced while playing. Your ears are more sensitive to higher frequencies than lower ones, so the more emphasis there is on the attack and higher frequencies the more you "percieve" the drum to be louder. Pull out a decibel meter (you can download an app on your phone) and you will find both drums are within spitting distance of the same volume.

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