What is the factory bearing edge on an MCX?

[XMahkaihX]

Hey there my friends. Sorry if this is a re-post, I searched for it for about 45 minutes but couldn’t find anything.

Well, I am ALMOST done with my MCX project; I re-wrapped it in Pewter Glass, put Reference/Masterworks hardware on it, did a few other mods and had a lot of fun in the process in seeing it change. I sold my Masters Premium and am within a week of jamming on a "new" kit. But the only mod I have left to do and am antsy to get on with is having the bearing edges rounded. I’m not a big fan of Maple as it is, and I’m tired of killing sweet sound by using EC2's. I know it will be a LOT warmer and smoother if I have the bearing edges rounded, so that is something I shall do.

Now my question is this, what is the factory bearing edge on a Masters kit? Anybody know? Al...? Lol. Just let me know guys, its much appreciated as it will help me determine how I want the new edges to be. Thanks a ton!

[Jutt8]

Sharp 45

[XMahkaihX]

Thanks for the ultra quick reply man lol. Now is that on the toms and the bass as well?

[premiumdrummer]

just wondering,
if you don't like maple, why didn't you just sell the master premiums, and the mcx's and buy a masterworks, or a kit that you liked the wood/look to? you probably paid a nice bit for the lugs alone. Just wondering, not knocking you or anything..
anyways sounds like a cool project, can't wait to see pictures.

[Jutt8]

yes, sharp 45 on everything. I'm a little confused. Which Masters premiums did you have? Why would you sell those, keep the mcx and put all the money into an mcx only to modify it with different hardware and edges? Of course it's your kit, I'm just trying to understand the whole concept of why you are putting lots of cash into an mcx when you're not fond of maple in the first place.:confused:

[XMahkaihX]

Great question! Well mainly because I had the older Premium kit, not the new one with all the Ref/MW hardware and fancy finishes. It was pretty basic and bland, I would say 2000 era or so. And my MCX was just boring old finish. Like my Masters Premium sold for exactly what I wanted, not more by any means, I knew it wasnt a super valuable kit, same with my MCX. So I just opted to build up the MCX as I didnt want to molest a Masters Premium. And I guess im not a huge Ref fan. Just knowing that I could spend an extra $500-$1,200 over a Ref kit and get a Masterworks or DW Custom would eat me alive!

But honestly, the lugs werent bad at all. I bought everything smart and on the cheap. Like I got a 14x14 Ref floor tom for $225, so I took the lugs and leg brackets off, put the MCX lugs/brackets on it, and sold it to a buddy of mine for $200 and bought more lugs that way, he was happy, I was happy, so it was a good deal for everyone.

The Aluminum Opta-mounts were only $30 a piece, and the Ref/MW bass drum spurs were $75 for two, and the floor tom leg mounts were $40 for three so that was cool, I sold the other two opti's, floor tom leg brackets, and Masters spurs for a few more lugs. Then all the mods were done by my drum guy, so he hasnt charged me for anything but materials that he needed and I know a guy that makes wraps so those were cheap too. So in the end its been labor intensive over costly. But yeah, just a little history on my meaning behind it!

[Jutt8]

Gotcha, you might want to edit that your Masters kit because it was not a Masters Premium kit if you got it in 2000. It was either a Masters Custom or Masters Studio. I'm being technical, but that is what is confusing about the whole thing. Masters Premiums are the upgraded version of the previous Masters lines (Custom and Studio) which is what you had. The Masters Premiums have only been out since 2007 I believe and based on my experience, they are the highest quality Masters kits to date. That's why when you said you got rid of a MP kit and kept the MCX I was like WHAT???????? WHO WOULD DO THAT???

Thanks for clearing that up. Hope you end up with something great although I think what you have is great unmodified:D.

[XMahkaihX]

I actually dont know when it was made. I bought it NOS and just know that it was "older" in a sense of hardware and the finish, its was very bland and boring. Al told me that the early MP kits werent special by any means, he told me it was probably a first year...I still didnt know when that was lol. But yeah it wasnt amazing and I always wished it were "more" after checking out MP kits here on the Pearl forums, some of you guys got INCREDIBLE MP kits. But regardless, thanks man! It is great now, I just cant WAIT to hear and see it finished! Its only been about, hmm...8 months now? Yeah, cant wait!

[dlute]

Instead of cutting new bearing edges on your MCX, get rid of the EC2 heads. Put on a different head that will warm up the drum, such as a coated Remo or Evans head. I would try this approach prior to sonically changing how the drum was designed by cutting different bearing edges. There are heads out there that will give you the "warmer/smoother" sound you are looking for, rather than cutting the bearing edges.

I have MMX Masters drums with sharp 45 degree edges. The Remo Vintage Amabassador or Remo Renaissance heads make these drums very warm and smooth.

[XMahkaihX]

See that was my approach when I first got the kit, but then when I would try to use something to make the sound warmer like coated G2's I would get the warmer tone, but they would resonate for 100 years, and I REFUSE to use moongels or O-Rings. I like a natural head no matter what. Now what would be amazing is a drum head that not only warms the drum and smoothes out the highs but a head that also cuts sustain without robbing tone. I have used half a dozen heads and not one has given me exactly what I want with a maple drum. I know there’s going to be those people telling me to stop using maple, but there’s no reason that a solid drummer can’t make any shell material work...at least that’s my opinion. But when I get 10k I will build my dream DW kit with X-Shells and I can finally use clear G2's over G1's. But man if you got an idea that would help with my sound, please send me some ideas, I’m open to hearing anything out!

[dlute]

I am curious what makes you think that a $10K set of DW drums with G2's over G1's are going to create a sound that does not have a ton of resonance. That is what high quailty drums are designed to do...resonate. Put the combo of 2-ply over 1-ply heads on any quality drumset and they will resonate. Better get use to use Moon Gel or O-rings, or the use of Evans Hydaulic heads if you don't want a drum to resonate. The tone you are looking for comes from resonance.

IMO what you are trying to achieve is counter productive to high quality drums. But to each their own on the sound they are trying to achieve. I just think you can do with with low quality drums and save your money.

[XMahkaihX]

Well the key to that is that EVERY drum resonates differently; maple is not my sound of resonance...period. X-Shells with G2's over G1's are.

Maple is bright with a ton of high end attack, so when it resonates you get a ton of bright ringy overtones, so an open sounding head on a maple drum is absolute overkill with sharp overtones, and sadly EC2's just cut too much, but I still haven’t found the perfect balance yet. I’m looking for smooth, warm, and balanced with nice shapely high end attack. I have been told by many people that the correct bearing edge can make a huge difference on any kit, but more so on maple and birch. So there’s no doubt in my mind that this will really make maple sound more "me". Especially since my drum guy asked me 1,000 questions first. As far as resonance on high end drums goes, Ref kits sound AMAZING with the ply they use, and I would never use EC2's on those bad boys or any high end drum like them for that matter.

As far as cheap kits...those aren’t any fun now, are they? A DW Custom is my dream kit, custom finish, custom built, gold hardware, gold 9000 hardware all around, and it’s made in the good ol US of A. Can’t get any better than that IMO!

[dlute]

BTW, I agree that rounding over your bearing edges will create a smoother, rounder sound. I use to have a set of Ludwig Maple Classics with 30 degree edges and they definitely had a very smooth sound to them. I was just trying to save you some money before going to the expense of doing something to a drum as drastic and semi-permanent as cutting new bearing edges.

Once your new bearing edges are cut, you might try one of the Vintage A or Renaissance Remo heads. They definitely have a warm sound that articulates more of the mid-range and low end. I would love to hear them on a set of African Mahogany drums with 30 degree edges.

[XMahkaihX]

Classic Ludwig = light weight and super smooth sound, gotta love em. Best drums to play shows with because of the weight IMO, that is if you set your own kit up. But no fear, the fee for having all of the edges rounded can be taken care of with one bill, so im not real worried about expense. And im pretty confident that it will improve the tone im going for quite a bit.

But I might give the Remo's a try, I havent used Remo's since the stock heads so that might be something to try. Thanks for the advice! And see my only problem with Mahogany drums is that they are too low for my taste and dont have enough highs/high end punch, and if its a cheap Mahogany drum set than its extremely muddy. But if done correctly like the Pearl Mahogany kit, I think they would sound pretty killer.

[TWH]

Re-cut bearing edges will get you closer to the sound you want. I would suggest ref type edges...............a "soft" round 45 for the toms, and fully rounded on the floors and kick.

How about specs on your kit and maybe some pics?? Would like to see the re-wrap job.

[XMahkaihX]

Yeah I dont know much about the edge degrees, so my dude is just going to cut them according to the sound I want and the heads I want to use. And hes been doing it for over 35 years so I feel safe about his work.

As far as the specs, the kit is a 10x8, 12x9, 14x14, 16x16, and 22x18. Im not real fond of the two rack toms, I would much rather have a single 12x10 but whatever its all good! Ill get pics up as soon as I can, but I dont have a digi cam so it may be a while but ill make it happen for sure.

Now the wrap job turned out perfectly, I bought two Pearl BD hoops in Pewter Glass and my guy matched it perfectly throughout the whole kit. Oh and im using a 10x5 Pewter Glass Firecracker snare as a Timbale mounted via ISS mount with a TH2000 tom arm. So everything is Pewter Glass but my snare now.

[ryctor]

First, Maple is not bright, is warm, very warm, warmwr than birch, higher mids than African mahogany and bubinga, but not brigt by any means.

The overtones come from the tuning or lack of, warped triple flangedhoops, bad bearing edges, and nothing rings more disonant than a poorly tuned reso head.

Maple, tuned med low poseeses a sweet spot that makes a 10" tom sound huge and deep, vs the brigter, more cuting sound of a birch 10 " tom.

A well tuned coated emperor should be enough to cut on overtones, butthe sustain can last forever.

I can cut the sustain in a well tuned drum, both heads in phase with the fundamental pitch of the shell, both head to the same pitch or very close(max sustain), by simply turning the reso head from 1/8 to 1/4 of a turn up in all t-rods. This creates a subtle or a drastic change in phase where the heads start to cancel each other, or cancel each other completely, creating either the bending efect with less sustain, or a completely dead sound, with no sustain at all.

No need to cut the bearing edgesfor that, actually, this will improve the control over overtones, but if tuned well, the drum still will sustain a lot.

This is also used to control the sympathetic buzz of the wires in a snare drum. If the snare is tuned for max resonance, you can feel the shell resonating and vibrating a lot, and the wires if the drum is played close to the edge, keep vibrating for the duration of the sustain of the drum. To control that, a tighter reso, out of phase, cancel the heads and keep the shell from resonating the most, to a point where the drum sounds very tight, the wires stop faster, and the heads take a lot of the sound, as the shell is barely or not resonating at all. As the heads are out of phase, they respond less to sympathetic vibrations from the toms, as the heads are not vibrating freely in phase, this stops a lot of the buzz.

For a fast decay, tighter reso, by just a tad! Or more if less sustain is wanted.

If you want to open up the drum again, turn to the beater and start tuning up, the heads will be in phase again, but as the reso is tighter, it will be in a higher pitch, but with the sam sustain, if a high end drum is used. Those have a greater tuning range, which, IMHO, is what separates them from the med and lower end kits.

Good luck!

[XMahkaihX]

Sorry it took me nearly two weeks to respond everyone, I have been out of town without my computer!

Well my friend, I think you are confusing bright with smooth, maple is very smooth and tonal balanced yes, but it truly is a bright wood. Look at the history of guitars, if an acoustic guitar or hollowbody is made of maple, it’s because its meant to be a "bright" guitar, maple is indeed a bright wood, it’s just smooth, hence the reason it’s so popular with instruments of all sorts.

Now on tuning the reso head's I feel ya, actually on both my heads (top and bottoms) I tune them all medium-low, it truly is the sweet spot on an MCX in my opinion, but without a well coated multi-ply head or something like an EC2 unwanted "sharp overtones" are still there. It’s the smooth cutting overtones that one is normally after.

And again, I can’t say this enough obviously, I’m not cutting the bearing edges to cut overtones, it doesn’t really work that way as you all know, I’m aiming to smooth out the over-all tone of the kit and get more of the sound that I desire out of drums.

As far as my snare wires go, they don’t buzz when I hit other drums or cymbals, I have my all three of my snares tweaked and modded for that perfect sound, so no worries of that here.

But thanks for all of the advice my friend, you obviously know your stuff! But the bearing edges are something I’m dead set on cutting. I know the tuning is critical, but for under $100 I can’t complain a bit, it will alter the drums greatly making them more me and it’s a cheap/huge modification. I will also be able to say that they are even more "original" than they were from the factory.

I'll be sure to post some pics soon!